Apparently (and I say this since I've only heard through conversation with people who should know, not first hand) Canada Basketball is imposing some rule modifications at the U15 championships. I'm not sure of their entire rationale but my guess would be with a number of provinces not sending teams recently they want to make it more inviting to teams/provinces that would have less skilled individual athletes. Giving teams more time to work on getting better shots for their kids and allowing for more cutting and passing.

A couple of the rule changes I've heard about:

- 6 more seconds on the shot clock from 24 up to 30.
- Making ball screens illegal (not sure if they mean foul or violation, but they want to eliminate the ball screen usage at this level).


As I stated I don't know all the rule changes or the entire rationale behind them. To this point I don't think its a good idea but I'm sure someone who knew enough could change my mind. Has anyone heard anything else about this? What our the thoughts and feelings on rule modifications that we currently make here or should make?

I just thought this would be a good topic starter during a quiet time.

I can confirm the rumors are true.

- 30 second shot clock (but 8 sec to cross center)
- no zone defense...not even full court
- no ball screens

I don't think this is to "win back" the smaller provinces. I think those who know Mike MacKay would say this is consistent (except of the shot clock change) with what he has been preaching for some time now. The rational I've been given (by BNB & CB) is they are trying to reduce the stuff coaches need to teach, especially the complexities of defending ball screens. The hope is more time can be spent teaching kid the necessary ball screens skills.

It would appear the U15 game will become more guard oriented this year which isn't necessarily a bad thing for NB or other small provinces.

I know Mike and maybe he should get over himself for a second and let the game develop itself...24 second shot clock was his baby forever and now he his a proponent of the 30!!! This is a total shift in his viewpoint and I am hoping he did not have anything to do with it or I have one word to say...CONSISTENCY! No ball screen and no zone at the National level so basically restricting our best U 15 players in Canada to a set of rules for developmental purposes!? We are starting to try and develop players by setting rules which will force Coaches to teach skills...Who do these decision makers think they are? I find it very arrogant and with little thought but we continue to listen to these guys like they are Basketball Gods...Anybody watch Rautins coach a game? Canada is not improving on National Stage and its not about our rules!

Let our elite athletes learn all aspects of the game and stop changing the rules...focus on training coaches and not changing the game...Basketball Canada is a joke! Watch their crappy commercial and send your 5 bucks to promote them but I wont be ...

I have a couple of thoughts on this....
1. Are we truly helping coaches/athletes here? Think about it this way....Lets say our provincial teams (U15) are playing a club team or another group in an exhibition game or tournament before Nationals. Is that club team going to be using ball screens? Are the coaches going to not have to teach how to defend them and how to use them? I do not see how this really helps coaches or players any....I believe coaches will still need to spend time teaching the various aspects of the ball screen in there practices.
2. Are referees going to call an illegal ball screen? Will it be a foul? Turnover? Can we really fault a kid with a turnover for setting a ball screen?
3. There has been no indication as to how zones will be enforced...Will the Ref issue a technical? What is the penalty?
4. Canada just had two players in the McDonalds All American game this year. We are sending four teams to World Championships this year....are we not heading in the right direction? Are we not developing players (perhaps at a higher level then ever)? Do we really need these changes....I know when Cory Joseph played U15, he came off ball screens....
5. The 30 sec. clock doesnt seem to add up....finally getting everything to the 24 was an accomplishment, now let's go back to the 30? Can we not make up our minds....

just some thoughts....

I’ll agree the change to a 30 sec shot clock is inconsistent with what CB has been telling us for the last 5 years, however, I also don’t know the rational behind the decision. Maybe it’s the coaches pressuring Canada Basketball to change back. Who knows?

For me I don’t mind the “no zone” and “no ball screens” rules. This means I have a little less to put in place. Given the limited amount of practice time the U15 provincial teams have to get ready for Nationals this is fine by me.

I’m also pretty sure there will be coaches out there spending a lot of effort trying to find ways around the new rules. They’ll have run-and-jump presses instead of zone presses. They’ll trap the ball and guard passing lanes (not necessarily people) behind the trap. They’ll have their wing players dribble drive behind cutters (like a pick play with receivers in football) instead of ball screens. And of course, they’ll play a sagging man-to-man with lots of switching on screens attempting to protect the paint area. All kinds of goodies for our elite players to prepare for.

The issue about playing club teams who will be playing zone and/or running ball screens is a legitimate concern. This might impact the U15 coach’s decisions about going to the states to play games.

Your response already proves a point...Not sure if we would play in the states( best competition), club teams , etc...Already negatively impacting Canadian basketball by resricting who we could play cause of rule differential...Ball screens and zones have been in the game forever...Not going to impact how much less you work on things ...Cause zone offence is about quick ball movement and reading defence...hmmm sounds like a vaguely familiar concept... And ball screens??? Screen roll has beenn around since the inception ...Give Naismith credit!

Teams are going to switch every screen and contain everything with a pack line defence anyway so their will be no rotations or at least very little...Run n jump take zone principles anyway...This Canada Basketball initiative is garbage...Teams not going to Nationals is not about Rules, its about the MONEY!

Money?????? Who is making money off Nationals?

Its about the cost to attend Nationals..This is why the decline in attendance...Money can be sent elsewhere and receive better competition for less then half the cost is what was meant...And without Crazy rule modifications I may add...

Well I’m already on the record for my views of attending Nationals versus spending the money on alternate competitions. If we evaluate solely on cost then you’re right. More cost effective alternatives are available.

If you believe Canada should have a National development model for the sport and that every player, coach, referee and fan in Canada should work towards improving that model then other arguments come into play.

I believe preparing for and competing at a national championship tournament is one of the best experiences our athletes can have, regardless of the rules of play. We’ll play the hand we’re dealt then provide feedback to the decision makers.

One thing is for sure; if we’re not at the table we can’t provide that feedback and therefore lose any influence we might have.

I believe in bein part of the Natiionals...Just dont dictate different rules and play judge and jury of how the game should be played! No...you are right ...I am not at the Basketball Canada decision table as its an exclusive club but I am very much concerned about NB basketball...

If we agree there needs to be a national development model, then we have to agree that Canada Basketball is responsible for the evolution of that model. What better place for CB to try new ideas for the train-to-train age group than at U15 Nationals. These changes only impact a few hundred athletes for 3-4 month period and CB gets to watch all games in person.

Following Nationals these players will still have the same working knowledge of how to attack zone or to defend ball screens they ended their high school seasons with. No more but no less. However, they should have a better understanding of playing & attacking man-to-man.

Interesting discussion...
I've heard recently that discussions like this are taking place with coaches across the Country in relation to the rule modifications. I'm hearing that there will be some further discussions at the ED meetings in the spring...just what I'm hearing...

I understand where Hardfouls is coming from on a lot of things. I personally do not like the no ball screen rule, as I stated earlier, I think that coaches will still end up needing to spend time on teaching it as there will be club teams and exhibition games where it will be used. Will Summerfest Refs be told to call illegal ball screens? Has there been any indication on what violation will be called on one?

I really have no issue with the zone rule, but like people said earlier, it will lead to saggy mans and switching everything, so it's sort of a toss up.

I really an confused over the shot clock concept, as it was so heavily sold as the way to go in the past, and now we're changing it back?

Cost is a major factor with Nationals and there can be major arguments both ways. I must say I do have some reservations about U15 Nationals and whether or not we are spending our money in the most efficient way. Perhaps a more regional approach, with more teams/athletes competing would be an option....Not looking to ruffle feathers, but something to be considered.

I'm sure discussions will continue over what is best for each age group and region. I personally think that 24 is plenty on a clock. I understand people may want more time to execute offensive skills, but it seems to me if you want kids to develop better skills a game is lousy place work on reads and skills. Better practices, better practice habits, more competitive fire beyond jump ball to horn, better coaching will get you much more skilled kids then another 6 seconds on a clock will. It just becomes 6 more seconds that coaches can try to control the game, and kids on the floor can get away with not being able to take their own person or knock down a shot or make a play.

As for the other rules I can appreciate the sentiment behind them but I don't think they end up having the impact you want them too. Unless you've got a unique schedule or situations kids are going to end up defending and attacking zones just about every weekend except the nationals. At nationals your going to end up seeing sagging/switching defenses that act the same as zones and offenses will run handoffs, blur screens and pass and cut off the posts to get similar action anyway.

I think its great that CB is trying to get the focus on individual skills and not tactics even at a u15 national level, I'm just not sure this attempt gets them what they are looking for and not just more headaches.

I really wonder what the officials think of these rule changes?
I can't imagine they are going to be looking to call illegal ball screens etc...
My question is how are refs going to enforce the no zone rule? With a technical foul? Warning? i dont know...
Will they call ball screens? hand-offs etc as turnovers?
I can't imagine the officials will like these rule changes.....

It's like I've said in the past here. These rule changes in theory may develop skills. However, I think there are too many factors that would weigh against them in order for them to really work in the manner desired.

...interesting reading to say the least....

hmmm 24 sec vs 30 sec...zones vs no zones...ball screens , no ball screens.....

Despite , the best efforts of the rest of the world...the majority of the top players still are produced in the US...I think if we made a list of the top ten players in the world to have ever played the game or are playing now , the list would be top heavy with Americans....where they play with 35 sec shot clock and no modified rules ( their mini's even use 10ft basket)

Team Canada is dominated by players from Ontario ( no shot clock,federation rules ) and quebec (24 sec shot clock and FIBA rules) almost all of whom play NCAA...

I don't think its the rules we play under that develop players , its the attitudes and work ethic we develop in our athletes , that make them move on to be amoungst the elite....

Whatever rules we use , the most athletic , hardest working , strongest in character and attitude will be our national team players , ball screens or no ball screens...